Photo-Lettering is in da House

Rich and the House guys could be accused of taking this retro thing too far. Just when I was beginning to believe that some display typography of the 1970s might not be resurrected...

PS (in case anyone thinks I'm seriously dis'ing House). I really think its wonderful that House Industries have rescued this stuff and will preserve it.

And that's a huge point. Preservation. If anyone will give the PLINC collection its due, it'll be the gang at House. I can't imagine the loss if this stuff just disappeared.

I think there's still some steam in the retro scene. But when it does end, House will need a new spin.

hhp

I deal mostly with package design for retail collectibles, which a lot of times are retro television/movie collectibles. So House is an important source for type that can't be found elsewhere.

Does this mean House will be releasing all these typefaces digitally?

And, if so, how soon will we be seeing Tommy Thompson Colonial Triple Condensed 3?

Seriously, the P-L library contains more than just "retro" designs. House has got there hands on a real gold mine. It would take a massive amount of effort to convert even a tenth of the library. I am very curious about what they plan to do with it.

Several digital foundries have been buying up film. Ludlow UK is another. They've resurrected a number of typefaces through film purchases. "Retro" may be a current or dying fashion in the graphic design field, but the digital resurrection of historical typefaces serves other needs.

Actually, they don't plan to "do" anything with it, the first aim was to preserve the collection. They "may" dive in there at a later stage and see what they can pull out.

I'm curious: Preserve it from what exactly? Was it going to be recycled into toilet seats, or donated to a museum?

hhp

the film actually degrades pretty quickly. i assume they'll make dupes in an archival medium, if preservation is the goal.

Read the press release, perhaps find some more info, perhaps wait for more info to appear?

I'll be waiting to see what they actually do with it - I hope it'll be grand.

It's just that House seems to be have too much business savvy to really mean the line "we just wanted to preserve it"...

hhp

Well, I heard from a very reliable source that they're planning to release all of Ed's old fonts -- but I guess that's obvious from the press release.

Hrant, give someone some slack for once, they really do mean "we just wanted to preserve it".

Sally, read the press release: Benguiat says he did over 500 faces for Photo-Lettering, how long is it going to take to digitise all that, for a start (clue, it took Bengiat 35 years to generate them)? So I think your reliable source speaks out the back of their head, how could House have a "plan" to do such a thing, they're just a small team, with other projects on the go.

-- A Reliable Source

"A Reliable Source" signed "DO" ??? Sounds like the Bush administration.

But to stay on topic. My understanding is that it "was" much more easier to digitize photofilm specimens than it would be to digitize metal type specimens. Though that would depend upon the appropriate equipment necessary to "read" the film

FYI: Paul Bain has a massive collecton of photofilm typefaces available in reproduction at
http://www.incipit.com/
He has a PDF there of the list.

> they really do mean “we just wanted to preserve it”.

Well, that would be great. And it would make me start liking House for more than just their great fonts.

I still wonder about the timing though: was the collection being threatened somehow? Maybe paying for its storage became prohibitive for its previous owners.

(BTW, why wouldn't you use your name for such a "positive" post? You must understand that lack of accountability can lead to people discrediting your opinion as being spin.)

hhp

I still wonder about the timing though: was the collection being threatened somehow? Maybe paying for its storage became prohibitive for its previous owners.

That's usually the reason such archives end up being disposed of. I spent two days in Bad Homburg in February, with Fiona Ross and Gerry Leonidas, rescuing as much of the Linotype non-Latin archive as the University of Reading was able to house. Linotype needed to consolidate their storage to save costs, and there wasn't room for the non-Latin stuff any more. To their immense credit, Linotype arranged for us to go in and sort the material and also paid for the shipping to Reading.

Hrant, posting my real name here would bring me much more discredit than I would be concerned about in you not believing my posts.

I say, stop the speculation, why not just look around for the sources that do tell more, or just go ask the people at House?

Peter Bain will be speaking on 'Photo-Lettering' at the St Bride conference in October.

See www.stbride.org and then click on the conference for more information.

> posting my real name here would bring me much more discredit than I would be concerned about in you not believing my posts.

1) Do you mean to say that "reputable" people don't hang out here? Do you realize that such an attitude lessens the relevance of your own participation?
2) I actually believe you, at least to the extent that you believe House. Don't worry about me specifically, worry about what most people -including apparently reputable people- think about anonymity (especially when all you had to say was nice).

--

Peter Bain I highly recommend.

hhp

... worry about what most people - including apparently reputable people - think about anonymity ...

I think that regardless of the quality of the anonymous banter provided, we all get found out eventually. By the way, based on DO's IP address, he (or at least his ISP) resides in the UK. Possibly close to Battersea.

: )

Please don't get him started on how an IP address gives no clue as to blah blah blah.

At this point the only people who think he still has an objective bone in his body are fellow fanatics.

hhp

Point and match to Hrant.

Grant, yes, you certainly lost out there, big time.

Grant, it's not worth it, trust me.
He needs shock therapy, and I don't have the necessary hardware.

hhp

In an attempt to pull this thread back into the proper lane, I pose the following question. Given the current stable of tools and talent at our disposal, what amount of time would it realistically take to digitize the entire PLINC library? How would some of you tackle this job if you had the chance?

Good question.
But I think many of them wouldn't be worth it.

Like if you look at the site Gerald pointed to, you'll see that Bain chose 800 out of 3,500 to mention.

To be blunt, most type of any era is crap.

hhp

>To be blunt, most type of any era is crap.

>hhp

what about most talk?

Given the current stable of tools and talent at our disposal, what amount of time would it realistically take to digitize the entire PLINC library?

Hmm... 3,500 fonts... let's say, about one week per font, average.... About 70 years. If I could get 3,499 other font developers involved, about a week.

To be blunt, most type of any era is crap.

Hmm, I've always though that most eras of any type were crap.

Yes, most talk too. Some of mine is crap, and since I talk so much, the absolute quantity of my crap is high.

But in terms of percentage I'm nowhere near your 100%. Or have I missed a valuable post of yours? Assuming that's your real name.

hhp

If I could get 3,499 other font developers involved, about a week.

Count me in for a half dozen faces, Mark. Preferably some of the crappier ones. They should be easier.

> most eras of any type were crap.

Actually, I think Eras is usable. ;-)

hhp

So does my friend Danyon.

Uh, I wasn't trying to be coy. I just took a class at SVA last year, and heard a rumor. Maybe "all" was an exaggeration.

Anyhow, I'm no type professional, just a lurker here.

"If I could get 3,499 other font developers involved..."

Mark

I just checked. There are 313 members of TYPO-L. I don't know what this means exactly but it certainly means there ain't exactly a shitload of folks out there who are at all interested in this kind of thing.

The inability of the TYPO-L list to consistently discuss the topic of typography makes its membership a poor gauge for interest in the field.

I recall reading an article a few years ago stating that Photo-Lettering already had many of its fonts in PostScript ("and no, you can't buy them," I remember reading).

Why haven't I visited these people in New York?

I just checked. There are 313 members of TYPO-L.

So, more like a year then. Oh, wait. We're talking about the TYPO-L list? Make it five years. If we throw in the [T-D] list, double that.

> double that

:->
As we say in Computer Science: if it takes a programmer 1 week to write a program, it would take 2 programmers 2 weeks.

And I agree with Stephen that Typo-L is not a good reference. Plus Joe is right: you wouldn't digitize "all" the fonts in there because most of them have probably already been digitized!

hhp

[Referrring to post somewhere near the top, sorry I'm late];

Hrant:
"I think there's still some steam in the retro scene. But when it does end, House will need a new spin."

what about all that 'new' stuff? It's all going to end up retro one day soon...

If the time comes that House should ever be looking for designers to help make that conversion, I'd be up to taking on the task. I think it would be great to see the entire library done up before I die.

I'd especially like to work on the Ultra Bold Tyght Types...

Well-executed design often becomes fashionable, but that doesn't necessarily give it an expiration date.

But culture is in constant churn. Eventually nostalgia won't be "fashionable" (at least for a while).

hhp

>But in terms of percentage I’m nowhere near your 100%. Or have I missed a valuable post of yours? Assuming that’s your real name.

So, unless I'm personally known to you, I don't exist? Your arrogance is outstanding, even for an American.

This forum knows you only as it has experienced you. If that was your first post here (which seems to be the case), then your next move should be to contribute something of actual value.

BTW:
1) My "real name" comment was due to the slew of anonymous and pseudonymous attacks that I've historically received. Since over time the people who frequent a forum form a relatively slowly-evolving group, it was highly possible that you were one of goblins. And it still is highly possible.
2) I'm American mostly on some documents. I am much more Armenian, even though I've ever only had a two-month visa to Armenia proper.

hhp